Did Hoster 3.318 or 3.319 Delete Files?

[admin]

KMA Files Were Being Lost By Windows.

When disappearing files first surfaced, MTU put full effort into solving this never-seen-before problem. We discovered that in 3.318 & 3.319 when Hoster deletes the \Temp folder to remove the .MP3 and .CDG files created by unzipping them before playing, something in Windows reacted unexpectedly (aka a "bug"). Windows deleted various MASTER files (KMA, RTF, DOC, etc.) that had been referenced in the \Temp folder in the recent past. However, how it deleted MASTER files through this folder is a mystery. How a non-random selection of KMA files was deleted as seen below is also unexplainable.


Files Disappeared Abnormally

1. Karen K reported that only songs where the Brand begins with the letters "S" thru "Z" were left. Hoster could not do this.
   
   
2. Metalgodz reported that the only KMA files left on his computer were from Pioneer 19.
   
   
3. Pselph reported having used Hoster for over 2 yrs and never had any problems until upgrading to 3318 and then 3319. Today I turned my computer on and all 65,000 + songs were gone from my external hard drive-- it worked fine last night.
   
   
4. Karen K further reported that every time she searched for *.kma files with Explorer, the number found drops in half from the prior search, even after she reloaded her Pioneer discs. Hoster cannot do this. We now believe that Vista's Explorer was doing this "repetitive deletion" by moving files into its "virtual folder" as it finds more of them.
   
   
5. swany reported setting up for doing a show on my new HP laptop with Vista and 3.319 and all kma files were gone. Went to MTU.Community Forums and saw the post for the 3.320 upgrade. I installed it and restored my kma files from my backup USB drive. Viola all is well. BACKUP - BACKUP - BACKUP! An extra hard drive is not that expensive compared to the time to reload.
   
   
6. Lonman reported his Vista computer lost several regular music files. This said Vista was deleting other files not associated with Hoster.

Can You Recover Lost Files? YES!

1. CRITICAL to be able to recover lost files is DO NOT delete, move, import, or anything on the hard drive that would change the Windows NTFS tables that index where files are located.
   
   
2. Kim Komando, a nationally renown computer expert recommends running http://www.recuva.com/ to recover lost files.
   
   
3. Several users including MTU used http://www.recovermyfiles.com/ to recover lost KMA and other files.
   
   
4. Probably the best disc recovery program available, albeit rather technical for many of MTU's customers is SpinRite 6.0 from grc.com.

What is Hoster's Historical Performance?

1. gduns stated: "I have used Hoster since 2003, and have never seen anything like this."
   
   
2. Beavis state: "I assure you that this has never happened before with Hoster and I'm a user since 2002."
   
   
3. admin posted: "In my 40 years in business, starting with microcomputers in 1972, my engineering teams have created around 140 products that came to market. NEVER ONCE has a customer lost files because of our products. For 2 days we studied HOW Hoster could have caused KMA files to be deleted from your HDD. The answer is Hoster cannot delete files. Windows is doing this."

What Does MTU Recommend?

1. DO NOT RUN 3.318 or 3.319!. The code that deletes the \Temp folder somehow enables Windows to delete files it shouldn't.
   
   
2. BACKUP - BACKUP - BACKUP. The best protection against loosing files is to have a master backup drive with all your KMA files. We sell our USB 500GB 7,200rpm (fast) hard drive for $159.80. It can attach to any computer through a USB 2 port. Buy one, two or even three today!
   
   
3. Import new KMAs to an external USB hard drive, or to an internal drive into C:\MTU\KMA Files folder. This is our new default in 3.321 and 4.0xx for Windows 2000, XP and Vista.
   
   
4. Read and follow these instructions for upgrading Hoster on Vista.
   
   
5. Install and Run Video Hoster 3.321. The problem in 3.318 & 3.319 was removed in 3.320. However, 3.320 does not find and use your existing Songs Database, which makes it APPEAR that your KMA files are gone again. If you are running 3.320, to fix this run the Tools menu > Build Songs Database command to build the songs.mdb in the correct new folder. Version 3.321 fixes this automatically.
   
   
6. Hoster 3.321 is a free upgrade for anyone who has bought Hoster or an upgrade since May 30, 2006. You can download it from the Hoster Download Page.
   
   
7. If you have Vista, DO NOT ENABLE your UAC. Your KMA files in the Hoster default folder will disappear into Vista's VirtualStore folder! Hoster 3.321 solves this problem so you do not have to worry about the UAC bit at all.

MTU's Final Analysis of What Happened

The most important clue came from a simple fact that Jim Kercheval posted:

"Yesterday I lost all my .kma's in Vista. Note to MTU techs: In your build songs database dialog when it say to delete a folder you need to make the link NOT delete the folder from the hard drive!!!! At least if you put up a flagged warning that you are about to lose all your kma's if you continue to delete the folder!"

ddouglass (a long term user) stated: "If you delete a folder from the Build Songs Database dialog it does not delete the folder on the hard drive, just the list entry. The only way you could delete one is if you do so in the browse window when you are looking for a folder. This is a Windows function. Hoster cannot do this." This was the true answer as Hoster NEVER deletes folders, so we KNEW Hoster did not cause this.

Jim Kercheval answered: "I Did have 3.320 installed when this event took place! And it was through the dialog box."

admin answered: Jim, this was an important fact you gave us. We researched again today and discovered new documents about what Microsoft is doing in Vista. It is truly unbelievable this was not revealed when Vista was released! This is compiled from several Microsoft web pages:

"Data redirection, also known as data virtualization, provides a driver for the file system and registry that will redirect files written in protected locations on the hard drive. For example, if you run an application (Hoster) that writes a file to a folder in the C:\Program Files\ path (ex: C:\Program Files\Hoster\Songs for KMA files), this write will fail. Why? Because the access control list (ACL) on the C:\Program Files\ folder prevents standard users from writing to any folder under this path. When the "data redirection file system driver" receives the failure notice, it INSTEAD writes the file to C:\Users\[username]\AppData\Local\VirtualStore\, which is in the user’s profile."

It then became clear that even though importing KMA files under C:\Program Files\ worked perfectly under 2000 and XP, without any notice, Vista TRANSPOSES all files written to this folder to be under C:\Users\[username]\AppData\Local\VirtualStore\Program Files\Micro Technology Unlimited\Hoster\Songs. This full path NEVER appears in our Build Songs Database list, but somehow Vista was feeding the virtualized folder contents to build the Songs Database.

In essence, if your Vista User Access Control (UAC) bit is ENABLED, Vista never creates Hoster's default import folder. Jim Kercheval reported deleting a folder from Hoster's Build Songs Database (BSD) list, then looked on the hard drive for it, he didn't find it because it was never even created. We know how deleting in this list works, so Jim's FACTUAL post was the clue we needed. It is now clear that Vista imported Jim's KMA files into a folder it created in its hidden \VirtualStore\ path.

Read and follow these instructions for upgrading Hoster on Vista. To UPGRADE under Vista requires you to MANUALLY move all pre-existing files. Vista prevents Applications like Hoster from moving files; all part of their "Virus Protection". KMA files should move to a new C:\MTU\KMA Files folder, or a USB hard drive. Playlists files that you want to retain MUST be moved to C:\MTU\Hoster. All Hoster working files (songs.mdb, bucket.mdb, playlist001.hst, log files) will be in this folder. Your Songs Database is automatically built in this folder.

NOTE: Hoster upgrade or new installs under 2000 or XP is identical to the past 7 years.

Installing Hoster on a "virgin" computer happens like any other installation with nothing to move.

Two questions we kept asking at MTU were:
1. Why are so few 3.318/3.319 users loose files? , and

2. Why did this happen all of a sudden? Hoster 3.318 was released December 29, 2007. Teddyt was the first to report loss of KMA files when he upgraded from 3.312 to 3.319 on February 12, 2008. What happened? Was it a Vista upgrade that now changed how it worked? We'll probably never discover this answer.

We still don't fully know, but we think it is related to either re-enabling Vista's UAC bit, or never having disabled it in the first place to install Hoster. Vista on its own actions, moved the KMA files to a hidden folder.

MTU is now testing Hoster 3.321 for release. We have done our Professional best to insure nothing that Vista is doing will affect Hoster again. We discovered yesterday that:

1. IF... you have the Vista User Access Control (UAC) DISABLED, you are "probably" safe.

2. IF... you RE-ENABLED the UAC, you're files are hosed! Sometime after you do this, Vista will move all your KMA files, Playlists and songs database to these folders:
C:\Users\[username]\AppData\Local\VirtualStore\Program Files\Micro Technology Unlimited\Hoster\Songs (or \Databases or \Playlists). Windows can MOVE files in an instant as it just reassigns the folder they reside in. That is how so many files can disappear so fast. For Hoster or any App to delete files would take about a minute per 1,000 files, or over an hour for 65,000 files.

This "VirtualStore" Vista stuff is messing everyone up. Your files were under \Hoster\Songs, then all of a sudden they're not. Windows gives no warnings, no indication, and buried so deep no one would ever find them.