Legal or illegal

[billyo]

i just got done reading some of KIAA' s articles, and i'm kinda suspicious, those articles are written by them, i don't think it's an actual fact, like i read in another karaoke forum site ,it's just maybe to scare the venue owners, kj's etc.so they would join .. and if you look at their address, they are based in Willmington,Delaware, in which a lot of suspicious Co. ( telemarketers, ads you see on tv at night, ie. vacuum 's , ginsu knives and some non approved FDA medical products ) the reason they are based in Delaware was they don't wanna pay the taxes they were supposed to, a lot of these Co's. address are in Delaware, if you can watch any add on tv at night and check out the addresses.now who's cheating who...i also read that you can only have one copy of your orig. disc not multiple, if that's the case most of us are illegal, caused i bet we all have multiple copies of our hhd, i do

[ddouglass]

Originally Posted by RandyMcCharles

Now I understand why there are so many sports bars playing hocky and football reruns instead of doing karaoke or other music features. Oh for the simple life.

Bars also have to pay for the privelege of having TV for their customers too.After all the fees it is no wonder so many come and go.

[Musicman51]

Muzicman i tend to agree with everything you have said here. I have read up on this {organization} and by what i have read, most kj's don't support it either. Not calling then anything but concerned, as we all are. But i think most kj's don't like how this outfit is going about it. Also it's a form of selfpolicing, and charging a hefty fee to do it. They also expect you to put the finger on those you suspect of being illegal. But as i said, you better shore know for a fact they are, before you run up to the host put your finger in his face and call him a thief, in the name of some self ruling organization. Reminds me of the muscians union back in st louis in the late 60's early 70's when i played down on gaslight square. More busted heads then you could count, back then they settled dishonesty, job throat cutting, underpaying, stealing, venue turf wars the old fashioned way, with knives, clubs and guns. But with all said, i think in todays economy, there are those that will steal from their grandmother if they could get away with it. It's not right..nope...but it goes with the territory i guess. Would i, if i knew 100% for a fact some clown was running a piece of trash show with bought ebay hard drives that had stolen songs on it turn him in? well...after us local kj's had a short private talk with him, and he regained his health, most likely wouldn't have to....

[BooBoo]

I've spent time reading that KIAA site as well and I have to agree that the organization seems to be geared to only protect a fraction of the industry chain. The problem, as I see it, is the disk guys want everyone to be legal, but they are trying to find ways to skirt being legal themselves. That is probably why that AZ suit is for trademark infringement instead of copyright infringement.

I know the current disk manufactures don't want to hear this, but the music industry as a whole is missing out on a large segment of sales. They have the original tracks and could easily spin off original music minus the lead vocals and sell their own karaoke. The artists would be able to gain what they deserve from the sales just as they do now when someone buys the complete version. The version "we" would get could not be any more authentic than that, so its a win win. The music industry certainly has the means to police the obvious thieves.

[RandyMcCharles]

I have been told that some of the country music producers are starting to spin off karaoke tracks using the original backing music and vocals used by the performing artist. I hope this trend continues.

[billyo]

i've seen those, Brandsmart here in Fla. carries them, like 6 tracks were w/vocals by the original artist and 6 tracks are just pure karaoke tracks, original sound, i think the one i saw was by Carrie Underwood ,i'm just not into country, and most of the private parties i do are into old school 60's -90's & some top 40's kind of music ( i have so much country music on my files ) that's why i didnt bother buying one and they're cheap ...

[BooBoo]

It seems like it would be much more cost effective to use the original tracks. It would eliminate the cost of reproduction and would eliminate the crappy versions.

Maybe they could hook up with a company like SC to add the graphics, or buy one of the current makers program and do it themselves.

That would be the coolest CD out there. Half original songs and half with karaoke/graphics of the same songs. They would sell a ton of them.

[RandyMcCharles]

If I was Brandsmart I'd hook up with SC or Chartbuster or similar to brand and distribute my entire line, prividing original background tracks. If the rest of the industry went in this direction Sony would eventually buy SC and original and karaoke msiic woudl be produced and distributed by the same entitiies.

[ddouglass]

Originally Posted by billyo

i've seen those, Brandsmart here in Fla. carries them, like 6 tracks were w/vocals by the original artist and 6 tracks are just pure karaoke tracks, original sound, i think the one i saw was by Carrie Underwood ,i'm just not into country, and most of the private parties i do are into old school 60's -90's & some top 40's kind of music ( i have so much country music on my files ) that's why i didnt bother buying one and they're cheap ...

Do you know what brand they are selling under?

[billyo]

Originally Posted by ddouglass

Do you know what brand they are selling under?

i'm trying to picture the cover in my mind, caused this was a while back maybe 6 months ago,not sure if it was party time. or one of those off brand label ( black & orange cover)but i'm pretty sure ( 100% )that it says by original artist and original sounds on the cover, i dont know if you have Brandsmart in your part of town but Brandsmart is looks like an outlet bigger than Bestbuy ,but they deal mostly in kitchen and appliances ( tv's pc's etc. )not much in music..

[marklwood]

Originally Posted by bryant

My question is: Why would you bother to do it?

I used to make a lot more off of it when I was open 18 hrs a day. Now, I only open at 5 and start karaoke at 9, so it doesn't get the kind of play it used to. If it ever shoots craps, I won't replace it. Probably just play the computer or an MP3 player through the PA.

[bryant]

Originally Posted by Musicman51

But i think most kj's don't like how this outfit is going about it.

However, at least They are GOING ABOUT IT!

[muzicman144]

Originally Posted by bryant

However, at least They are GOING ABOUT IT!

Sound Choice is the main backer of KIAA, and they are skirting paying copyright fees by moving to Austrailia to avoid USA copyright laws on 4000 song files and ARE GOING TO SELL those files via website download back to american kjs where they will be illegal. Why would a KJ back an organization that is guilty of the same PIRACY they contend they are fighting.
I fail to see how a KJ can back them AS LONG AS Sound Choice is an integral part of the organization. What you are basically saying is "as long as you are fighting piracy, i don't care if you are a pirate". The KIAA should be boycotted as long as SC in involved.
muzicman144

[muzicman144]

I don't intend to beat a dead horse to death here, but here is an interesting website hosted by Eric Godfrey of the KIAA, www.wannasingaz.com , This site guarantees karaoke bars immunity from prosecution by the KIAA, if they take sign a 6 month contract that this site will pay for, plus they have an escrow account that will pay the bar $500 twice a year for BMI, ASCAP fees.
What bar in their right mind will refuse this. check it out
www.wannasingaz.com
muzicman144

[billyo]

Originally Posted by muzicman144

I don't intend to beat a dead horse to death here, but here is an interesting website hosted by Eric Godfrey of the KIAA, www.wannasingaz.com , This site guarantees karaoke bars immunity from prosecution by the KIAA, if they take sign a 6 month contract that this site will pay for, plus they have an escrow account that will pay the bar $500 twice a year for BMI, ASCAP fees.
What bar in their right mind will refuse this. check it out
www.wannasingaz.com
muzicman144

just read some articles on that web site and here's what that site said "bars are still responsible for ascap & bmi fees they can not pay them on your behalf " the escrow program is to help them ( the bar ) for their " programs " whatever that means , this is my opinion about Eric Godfrey, who is the president of most of karoake org.which is based i think mostly in AZ, i think he wanted a to take over the whole karaoke business in AZ, thats why most of these stuff about being legit is in that state ,and i think he owns starz karaoke which i think is an employment agency for dj/kj alike.....just like the good old mob days, you can not use a kj that is not theirs, or they will get cousin vinny on you in this case KIAA

[mindonstrike]

Originally Posted by ddouglass

Do you know what brand they are selling under?

Big Machine Records is at least doing Taylor Swifts stuff this way. both of her CD's are available as karaoke. It looks like they contracted Pocket Songs to do the graphics

Sam

[billyo]

Originally Posted by mindonstrike

Big Machine Records is at least doing Taylor Swifts stuff this way. both of her CD's are available as karaoke. It looks like they contracted Pocket Songs to do the graphics

Sam

is pocket songs the one with black & orange cover ? if it is that's probably the one i saw.

[Musicman51]

speaking of being legal...email, or call chartbuster karaoke. Tell them you own one of their cdg's, and ask them if it's ok with them if you download it on to your computer and use it with your karaoke hosting software on your hard drive, and post here what their reply is...

[RandyMcCharles]

I'm revisiting the question of legal VS illegal download sites as I can find no one naming names. I have found one propogated claim that "no download site is legal" with no citation to a legal authority stating such. And a statement from Kurt Slep of Sound Choice, “There are actually very few legal karaoke download sites. Most of the sites out there are not properly licensing and paying copyright fees on the music they are selling.” But no where can I find declarations of specific sites being legal or not. Someone earlier in this thread stated that he stopped buying downloads when he learned the practice is illegal 'in the US'. I visited several sites that have been around for awhile. They all 'claim' to be properly licensed. (Just as the CDG manufacturers claim to be properly licensed.) Few are in the US. CAVSUSA is the only US site I could find that has been downloading for years. Chartbusters says "downloading is coming". Sound Choice has a link on their site that goes to The Karaoke Channel in Canada, where you can download SC karaoke as video files.
Karaoke-Version in France offers only downloads. They won't burn a CDG.
So, is there an authority anywhere that can declare any of these specific download sites as legit or not? When Chartbusters turns on their downloads will they suddenly be legal? Or will they be as illegal as 'most of' the current download sites. As a Canadian can I safely purchase from a Canadian download site? (There are quite a few in this country.)

[ddouglass]

I don't know about Canadian Law, but the link for the SC titles is legit as they sold/transfered rights to that company for all there past releases. This would be more legal than a lot of the sites at least for SC created songs.
The Chartbuster site will be doing the same thing except they are retaining control, so they would be legal too.
CAVS, who knows I don't know where they get there songs from for downloading.
From what I can find Karaoke-Versions is a legit branch/sub-company of Recisio a French music production company, so it looks like they are legit too.
Even though a lot of the other sites claim they are legal, none of them state anything about being licensed by any of the production companies themselves. This tells me they are not legal.
Is there an authority or list of legal/illegal sites - none that I know of.
The legality issue is that a production company for Karaoke is supposed to have a license/permission to reproduce the songs they do. They in turn have the rights to license the sale of those songs by whatever format they wish to. Sale by CD is easy as they are the producers of the CDs and have their copyright on the label, but downloads do not.
If it was my site for downloading I would certainly post those agreements for each producer so everyone could see that they had permission to do so.