MTU.Community


Go Back   MTU.Community > Singers & Hosts Wisdom

Singers & Hosts Wisdom Post how to be a great karaoke singer or host.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old March 7th, 2002, 09:10 PM
MusicBear MusicBear is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Portage, IN U.S.A.
Posts: 26
Singers Bringing In Their Own CD+G's

Hello,

I would like to hear from the K.J's on this one...

I tweak my CD+G tracks with Keyrite, and then burn them into my own CD+G's using MTU's fine soft ware.

My question is: How do K.J.'s "generally" react to singers, as myself, bringing in their own home made Microstudio, CD+G's?

Is there any hesitation by K.J's to play these home made CD+G's at their gigs?

I have just recently bought Microstudio, and haven't as yet taken one of my CD+G's to a gig yet, so I am wondering what kind of reaction I will get from the K.J.'s?

Thanks for any replies!
Ray "MusicBear" Baker
__________________
Ray Musicbear Baker
www.musicbear.net
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old March 8th, 2002, 01:04 AM
danny_g danny_g is offline
Frequent Member
 
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 485
Ray,

There are some Show Hosts that won't let you do it, and they'll use the excuse that if someone saw it at the show you are at then they might assume that the host had the song. What they may really be doing is trying to protect themselves from being audited by KAPA because the disc isn't a store bought brand.
While there may be some that won't let you do it there are others, like myself that don't care whether or not it is a copied disc or not as it means another customer for the bar to them.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old March 8th, 2002, 09:00 AM
kking kking is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 7
Ray:
I agree with danny g. It doesn't matter to me if you bring your own cdg. I have singers that bring regular cd's with vocals and I allow them to sing with these. The only exception I make about this is if we are having a contest. It's really great to be able to communicate with singers on this forum. If you or any others have suggestions for us KJ's on how to make shows better or more fun for singers,please post your ideas.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old March 9th, 2002, 09:51 PM
admin admin is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Raleigh, NC, USA
Posts: 10,515
Its up to the Host...

MusicBear, there are some hosts who - for their own reasons - will not play discs a singer brings in; whether it has a home-made label or a store-bought label.

As to Karaoke Anti-Piracy Association (aka KAPA), you can read at their site what they prosecute. If you read closely, and review who they have gone after, you won't find a singer or a host who has the original discs somewhere. They are concerned about the real bootleggers who:

1. Buy one and make thousands of copies to sell.

2. Buy one set of discs and duplicate it for their other 10 rental Karaoke sets.

3. Buy one disc and make and give or sell copies to their customers.

You can read the US Copyright Law excerpts, especially on the Offenses and Penalties. It is very clear what each offense is, and making and using a backup copy is not on the list.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old March 20th, 2002, 07:28 PM
g. evans g. evans is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Newark
Posts: 1
singers bringing discs to show

My company has no problem. I would hope no one brings in vulgar material, or some headbanging song that is 12 minutes long, but what are the chances of that? Most karaoke enthusiasts are quite aware of "the program" and generally buy their discs open market and bring their favorites because not all karaoke companies are sure to have their particular songs they like to sing....that is the general motivation of the karaoke singer who brings discs to a show.
__________________
Kings of Karaoke
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old March 20th, 2002, 11:48 PM
Lauraine Graham- with the Lord Lauraine Graham- with the Lord is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: even nearer Littlehampton in West Sussex, England
Posts: 525
Bringing one's own CDGs

I have no idea what the protocol is in the US, but certainly in the UK it is not only accepted but welcomed by KJs. The principal is that the KJ wants participation and the patron may want to perform songs (or versions) which may not be in the KJ's catalogue.

I, myself, am a very keen karaoke patron and it used to p*** me right off when my chosen songs were not available, so I started bringing my own. I have never had the slightest hestitation from any KJ to my using them. Now I have produced my own songs, using backing tracks I have either bought "off the peg" or commissioned in the case of my original songs (I used to be a professional singer). Because of the high quality of the program no-one not in the know realises that these songs are not commercially available.

I hope these comments are useful, and they will allay your concerns. Go for it!

Best wishes
Lauraine
__________________
Lauraine graduated from her earthly life in July, 2010. We will all miss our "Damsel in Distress". She was an excellent Beta Tester, and a wonderful, dear friend across the pond.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old March 21st, 2002, 11:07 AM
MusicBear MusicBear is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Portage, IN U.S.A.
Posts: 26
Re: Bringing one's own CDGs

Quote:
Originally posted by Lauraine Graham
Now I have produced my own songs, using backing tracks I have either bought "off the peg" or commissioned in the case of my original songs (I used to be a professional singer). Because of the high quality of the program no-one not in the know realises that these songs are not commercially available.
Hello Lauraine,

Thank you for your reply; it was very encouraging!

I will be taking my first CD+G to a gig next Monday, and presenting the K.J. with it. We'll see how things go here in Indiana! LOL

I was wondering how the reaction went to your singing your own material at Karaoke gigs? I ask because I too am a songwriter, and have recorded two C.D.'s of my own, and would love to do some of my material at Karaoke gigs. I have used MTU's software, and have two CD+G versions of my songs, but hesitate to try them out at a Karaoke gig. Perhaps you can give me some encouragement!

BTW, what exactly is it you meant above, when you said you got them "off the peg?" Translation please... LOL

Thank you Lauraine, it was great to hear from you, and very encouraging I might add, especially because now after reading your post I might try taking some of my own material to my gigs.
__________________
Ray Musicbear Baker
www.musicbear.net
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old March 21st, 2002, 03:28 PM
Lauraine Graham- with the Lord Lauraine Graham- with the Lord is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: even nearer Littlehampton in West Sussex, England
Posts: 525
bringing one's own CDGs to a gig

My dear MusicBear

I surely do wish you every success, but I must put you straight on a point. It was perhaps ambiguous of me to say that I used original material. I am not clever or talented enough to write my own. I envy those who can. No no, the songs were written FOR me, not BY me.

As to the reactions of my fellow patrons, the reception was most gratifying. Whilst I take credit for an acceptable performance the main kudos goes to the songs. I say go for it! Do not forget that you will probably be in a friendly environment, that is, surrounded by supportive and tolerant karaoke enthusiasts, like yourself. I suggest that you first try out your songs where you are most comfortable performing, and where you are received the best. If it goes well, and I am sure that it shall, this will encourage you to try at the other venues you patronise.

I will give you another tip, if I may. Make your labels as good as you can make them. The better looking your product the more likely the KJ is to use it. If you hand over a CDR with scrappy writing over it the KJ may believe that you have illegally copied a disc and not want to place him/herself at risk (you won't even be given the chance to explain that it is original material, and that no copyright is being infringed!!!) If you have done a really good job he or she may not even realise that it is not a commercially obtained disc, and will be pleasantly surprised, even impressed, when it is learned that the material is yours.

You asked me to explain "off the peg" backing tracks. I had not thought that this expression might be a peculiarly British phrase. Sorry. It means a standard arrangement and not one especially recorded for you. The CDGs you buy are "off the peg", as are any backing tracks you might buy ready-made from any of the companies selling them, on the net for instance. Custom tracks are those you commission, specifying arrangement, key, instrumentation, etc. I am expecting one such through my letterbox tomorrow, as it happens.

I hope these comments are useful to you. If you want more please ask and I shall do my best, although I am no guru.

GOOD LUCK !!!!
Lauraine
__________________
Lauraine graduated from her earthly life in July, 2010. We will all miss our "Damsel in Distress". She was an excellent Beta Tester, and a wonderful, dear friend across the pond.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old April 14th, 2002, 06:45 AM
Lauraine Graham- with the Lord Lauraine Graham- with the Lord is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: even nearer Littlehampton in West Sussex, England
Posts: 525
to MusicBear

Dear MusicBear

Have you performed any of your songs at a gig yet, and if you have how were they received?
__________________
Lauraine graduated from her earthly life in July, 2010. We will all miss our "Damsel in Distress". She was an excellent Beta Tester, and a wonderful, dear friend across the pond.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old April 14th, 2002, 11:07 AM
MusicBear MusicBear is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Portage, IN U.S.A.
Posts: 26
Hi Lauraine,

Yes, in fact I gave it a shot last week.

I performed one of my own songs, and well, it felt really good.

The crowd was kind of "ho-hum" about the song and performance, but that didn't deter me. It felt really good.

Maybe the song just wasn't strong enough to grab them in that type of situation. I'll try another one, a song that is a bit bolder next week.

Good to hear from you!

Ray MusicBear
__________________
Ray Musicbear Baker
www.musicbear.net
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old April 14th, 2002, 11:20 AM
Lauraine Graham- with the Lord Lauraine Graham- with the Lord is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: even nearer Littlehampton in West Sussex, England
Posts: 525
Dear Ray

I am glad that it wasn't a total flop, but I was certain it wouldn't be. Do keep trying. Mr Lennon and Mr McCartney (I beg his pardon, Sir Paul) didn't have it all their own way to begin with.

Good luck
__________________
Lauraine graduated from her earthly life in July, 2010. We will all miss our "Damsel in Distress". She was an excellent Beta Tester, and a wonderful, dear friend across the pond.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old April 16th, 2002, 07:44 PM
George George is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 5,299
just subscribing. interesting reading
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old June 11th, 2002, 11:21 PM
DJNickieK DJNickieK is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Boston, Ma
Posts: 8
I happened to see this post so I thought I'd throw my 2 cents in.

Being a succesfull KJ and Dj since 87 I have been always open to the idea of letting people bring in and sing their own music cd's and karoeke cd's at my shows.

I think it brings in a special element of diversity and to open up people to all kinds of music and bring an original element to this kind of entertainment. A creative and fun element to be specific.

Having fun and a good time for all has always been what my shows have been about. That's why I've been in the buisness for so long. When it's stop's being fun - I'll retire -

For know I keep rockin that mike right on a saturday nite !!!!

Regards, Nickie
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old October 11th, 2002, 10:21 PM
mturacebannon mturacebannon is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 33
Question

To all interested parties (of which there appear to be alot)...

I regularly take my discs to the shows here in Oregon. I've taken both original CDGs (e.g. bought from Karaoke.com or some other outlet), copies of the originals (with a printed label - most not even close to how the original CDG's label appears), and CDG's I've created by via VoGone, KHPro, & MicroStudio.

Only once, have I had a KJ question where I got the disc from. He said that another person at the lounge had gotten into trouble w/ ASCAP.

I spoke w/ several other KJ's I know on a more personal basis. One KJ who is a former professional singer/band member (from back in the 60's) encountered a person from ASCAP wanting to see what songs he had for his show. He asked the guy to tell him what labels and/or artists he represented and that he (KJ) would remove them from his songbook. The 'ASCAP' guy refused to give him a list. The KJ sent the 'ASCAP' guy packing - in effect telling him how can I run a 'clean show' by not playing copyrighted material when you won't tell me what I can't play?

Anyway, my question is there is an issue of whether the songs on the CDGs are copyrighted. I was told to just slap any-old "copyright" on the label. Since I do not make copies of pre-recorded CDGs to sell or to use for multiple setups (I'm not a KJ) or make multiple copies of the material I've created using MTU products, should I put a copyright on these labels?

Opinions, please.

Mark
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old October 11th, 2002, 11:09 PM
George George is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 5,299
Mark,
You'll probably get several opinions on this one. Since KHP makes copies at least equal to if not better than the originals, as long as the back-up copy is in good condition, it really matters little whether the original gets damaged or not. With this in mind the safe route would be to take the originals to the show to sing from, wouldn't you think? I believe that's what the law calls for anyway, if being used professionally. The copywrited original is what's supposed to be used for public shows, not the back-up, at least that's my understanding from posts I've read in these forums. There is logic in that reasoning. If you have back-ups at a show and do get checked on, there is no way of determining the source, is there. conversely, if you bring originals to a show, then ther'es no question about it.Slapping any old copywrite on a copy is a short road to trouble, and at best a ploy. If you didn't think so, you wouldn't be asking, right?

take care,
George

Last edited by George; October 12th, 2002 at 09:19 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old October 12th, 2002, 06:43 AM
Lauraine Graham- with the Lord Lauraine Graham- with the Lord is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: even nearer Littlehampton in West Sussex, England
Posts: 525
Hello all

It is my understanding that when one buys a CDG one has been licensed to publicly perform all the songs thereon, otherwise what is the point? Does one just admire the disc as a work of art? I think not. The vast majority of CDG sales are to professionals for the specific purpose of public performance.

Regarding copies; software companies always advise backing up their product in order to use the copy and safely store the original. However, I don’t think that the CDG producing companies like our backing up their products. They would prefer that if the disc has been damaged beyond repair we should purchase another copy. I can see their point. However, there are many discs (I have quite a few in my own collection) which cannot be replaced; either the production company is out of business, or the disc is no longer in print, or whatever. So blow them, I back up every disc I buy. I have never had the slightest problem having my discs accepted by any KJ. If I ever did I would leave immediately and never patronise that KJ again. Karaoke is very popular, and one can always find another venue.

The reasons I started bringing my own discs to shows are these:-

1. I don’t see very well and I got fed up hurting my eyes reading the small print of the books in badly lit venues. I had to take a magnifying glass, and this caused quite a bit of friendly teasing, I can tell you!
2. After ploughing through these often massive tomes I would find only a few songs I wanted to sing, usually the same ones as at the previous show.
3. Even when I found a song the graphics would sometimes be too small. Sunfly were the main offenders but they have cleaned up their act now, thank goodness. Also the sweep was unsatisfactory in many cases, not presenting the lyrics in time so that cues were often missed if one was unfamiliar with the words. Another annoyance was if the lyrics were incorrect, usually silly mistakes, almost as if someone (whose first language is not English) was taking dictation from the record and either mis-hearing or not understanding, you know, the “it is are not raining here also” syndrome.

All these frustrations were eliminated when I bought KHP and MicroStudio (I also bought Keyrite and Vogone). I could re-do the song so that the sweep was acceptable and make compilation discs of all the songs Ron and I wanted to sing. I was now able to purchase backing tracks to make new songs which I could not find on a CDG with sufficient other songs to make the purchase worthwhile, or were simply not available. Then I discovered Soundprobe. This is a marvellous wave editing program, which means that now I can change the arrangement to suit myself, change the key (I have an unusual vocal range) set the lyrics how I want them and compile the finished results on a few discs. I am now a very happy bunny, because singing is our main entertainment. Thank you MTU, thank you very much.

You carry on taking your own discs and KJs please continue allowing your patrons to use their own discs, assuming as one has to that they have come by them legally. It can only enhance your show by adding variety and patron satisfaction. It also means that you will not be asked to purchase the disc on which this particular song is included, therefore it is cheaper for you.

Good luck and best wishes
__________________
Lauraine graduated from her earthly life in July, 2010. We will all miss our "Damsel in Distress". She was an excellent Beta Tester, and a wonderful, dear friend across the pond.

Last edited by Lauraine Graham- with the Lord; October 12th, 2002 at 07:18 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old October 13th, 2002, 03:20 PM
SteveWalker SteveWalker is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 363
Hi Lauraine,

Quote:
It is my understanding that when one buys a CDG one has been licensed to publicly perform all the songs thereon, otherwise what is the point? Does one just admire the disc as a work of art?
You are right again! The karaoke CDG companies especially Sound Choice must think it's their own artwork! The real truth is that they're just copy cats of the real ARTISTS not unlike a cover band. I hope Sound Choice is fairly compensating the original artists on their CDG's. The original artists would be smart to make their own karaoke CDGs from the original recordings. Many of the multi-track recordings are still available and would be simple to remove the lead vocals to make a CDG. You could even create instrument karaoke on DVD using the dolby digital decoding to pick and choose vocals and instruments.

Quote:
Regarding copies; software companies always advise backing up their product in order to use the copy and safely store the original. However, I don’t think that the CDG producing companies like our backing up their products.
Exactly but the CDG producing companies don't write the copyright laws either. In the case of Sound Choice, I'm just waiting for a huge backlash against these rednecks from up in the hills. Again, they don't write the laws and karaoke companies and stores exagerate the applicable laws to scare us while lining their pockets.

Quote:
You carry on taking your own discs and KJs please continue allowing your patrons to use their own discs, assuming as one has to that they have come by them legally. It can only enhance your show by adding variety and patron satisfaction. It also means that you will not be asked to purchase the disc on which this particular song is included, therefore it is cheaper for you.
Lauraine, it's not the KJ who really cares about this is it? It's the CDG companies and karaoke stores who so afraid they might lose some dollars (or pounds) that are threating the KJ's into submission with their own unique (incorrect) interpretation of the copyright laws.

Case in point: Mugs and Jugs Karaoke Bar in Clearwater was warned to NOT accept a singers copy of a CDG or they could be raided and all their karaoke equipment confiscated. I was told that the local karaoke store made this threat.

Steve

Last edited by SteveWalker; October 13th, 2002 at 08:41 PM.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:56 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.1
Copyright ©2009 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
The contents of this forum are copyrighted by Micro Technology Unlimited, 2000-2008. Use of any material from these Forums is prohibited without written agreement from MTU.