The Lawsuits Have Started In Virgina

[ronw]

Beware KJs, Slep-Tone Entertaiment and Sound Choice Studios Are putting spotters in restaurants, bars, grills, etc. They where at one of my shows in September 2009. I was served with a lawsuite on Jan 13 2010 for displaying the Sound Choice marks without right or license at my karaoke show. You can click on the following link to view suite.

http://dockets.justia.com/docket/cou...ase_id-249441/

[ddouglass]

Are you playing illegal copies of their music or do you have your originals?
Looks like they hit everybody including the establishments.

[ddouglass]

Ron you may find this document useful in your lawsuit.
http://www.uskaraokealliance.com/ima...elease9-08.pdf

[ronw]

Yes i have my originals I was just filling in for someone that night, I run a clean show i dont play any singers copied songs kind of sad

[bryant]

Originally Posted by ronw

Yes i have my originals I was just filling in for someone that night, I run a clean show i dont play any singers copied songs kind of sad

Didn't they ask you for the originals of the songs they witnessed...I mean how else can they say that you were displaying "unlicensed" material?

[ronw]

Hi Bryant i run my shows of a laptop no one said anything to me at all that night the lawsuite said they just blend in they sing songs take pictures of your songbook like i told dale, I was just filling in for some one that night for all i no they could have been there to get him i no he has more then 20000 songs in his books in the lawsuite sound choice has as a settlement offer to by there Complete Catalog of 5,200 songs for 6,500 dollers and they will drop the lawsuit thats what i dont understand

[muzicman144]

I have stated many times that i really believe 98% of all Kj's have a least one illegal file. My bet is Sound Choice is putting all its marbles on the table using that same thought. That being the case, it is like extortion, pay me $5-6000 Dollars, or, join the KIAA, and your troubles will go away. One file may cost a KJ that much in damages in an actual court case, and it has happened, although a different case was made. I believe Sound Choice is one of the best karaoke producers out there, but, maybe the KJ's of this country should start a boycott of SC's products until they get out of the game of extorting the very people who have supported them over the years. In any other case, if someone threatens you with a lawsuit, you no longer do business with them. Wake up out there!!! Use the product you have, but do not do business with them until they get OUT OF YOUR BUSINESS!!!!
JMHO
muzicman144

[Musicman51]

I tend to agree with bryant. If they didn't ask you to produce those originals, then you aren't illegal. However, on the other hand, they really don't have to ask you anything in order to file an infringment lawsuit, winning it? thats another matter. Seems they are targeting those with computer shows. Now as far as i'm concerned, a judge will laugh them out of the courtroom when it comes to the suits against the club owners. There is no way for a club owner to know what is on that hard drive. You could show him one hard drive, and use another. Nope..i betcha this won't pass the legal smell test, but wil be interesting to take a watch and see.....
Walt, i'm with you. I'm all but done with the Sound Choice folks. If business is bad enough for those at SC, that they have to "Sting" kj's and club owners, i just don't care to be associated with them. In fact it's been awhile since i've purchased a sound choice CDG. Perhaps this will boost sales for "KH Pro" & "Microstudio".hehehe

[Musicman51]

Sorry for the double post dale. But i read that Sound Choice letter, and excuse me for laughing. I really enjoyed the part that read "we will give karaoke show host every opportunity to prove that they have legally purchased Sound Choice re-recorded tracks prior to contacting venue owners/managers". What a crock... since when does someone acused of doing something illegal have to prove he hasn't? hilarious. Ron, this is that money hungry RIAA at work here my friend, not sound choice. Sound choice is along for the money. I don't think they waltzed into your club and said "poof you're illegal". Something is missing here. A few suggestions for others. Don't show these morons anything. Not a hard drive, your original library disc..nadda. Make them show cause to a judge why they think you are illegal, thats the first step a discovery hearing. Second, if it got that far. You have a right to view the original licensing agreement sound choice claims to hold, not only for your songs they claim you use illegally. But for sound choices' entire library. Goes to the credibility of sound choice, if they produced even one song that they cannot produce a legal rights for..lawsuit is over. Remember ron, they have the burden of proof. The fact they want to buy you off tells volumes. Looks like they are testing the legal waters, and making you folks a scapegoat. I would sell my home, vehicles, file for bankruptcy, and live under a bridge before i'd pay these guys a dime. There is a right way, and a wrong way to go about doing things. And clearly sound choice has opened a can of worms they may in the near future wished they hadn't....I think walt has a great idea..boycott these guys. Apparently sales are down at sound choice. They really should be going after these guys that sell those loaded hard drives on ebay, and craigs list. And those big entertainment companies that run a dozen kj's, off one set of original disc. Pardon me...i'm nauseated at this whole mess, i think i'll get a sound choice disc out and barf on it...lol. I think billyo has the right idea..start doing this for fun...not making any money at it anyway..lol
Forgot to mention, i've been told to pass on to you ron, that sound choice has to prove damages. In your situation, the worse case scenario should be, that you must purchase the songs you are using of theirs that you hadn't purchased. Sound choice is out that sale of those songs for each hard drive. Not their entire libray..what crooks...lol yep sales are down...lol

[billyo]

i don't think any of us is making any money or gotten a return from our investments yet, i've spent over or under $12.000 on my gears , buying new stuff every month (yup every month )..sound choice can come to my show anytime, i dont think they will be able to get in, since most of the shows i do now are in a country club and that is a private " invitations only " place, the only " public place" i do is a Thai, Japanese Restaurant that after 9pm is for members only " i do have some non members that comes in, which is my regulars when i used to do public restaurants..one suggestion thing i could think of was if you have new faces that comes in to your shows, and if they keep requesting a sound choice tunes, that's maybe a sign that they are scanning your library , just tell them that you don't have it, or make them feel degrated, tell them that sound choice sounds bad, that they sounds like thin can, that you've deleted all of them,and if they asked you why you still have them in your songbook, just say you havent updated your books yet, i dont think that they will ask to see your library,

[billyo]

i apologized for double posting, i think the reason why they( KIAA and Sound Choice ) are looking at these things, ( besides the money ) it's because there are some KJ's that do a lot of shows and has people working for them, if you employ 5 people to do shows in 5 diff. venues, of course they will start looking at this,

[billyo]

I just learned that it is 99% legal to play songs/tunes that you bought in a store and that you paid for in a club or infront of people, from what i learned, they said that if you bought it from a store and you paid, lets say $10. for a disc, a portion of that goes to the artist, producers label makers etc. in other words everybody gets paid, and if you play a certain song/disc in a club or infront of people, those people might go out and buy the same disc and, this is what the people who made that disc wants, they want for you to go out and play the songs for people to hear, so i got to thinking Sound Choice might not be paying royalties to the artist and producers who made the original songs,and or may not have enough funds to pay them so they going after KJ's to get that MONEY to pay the original artist and KIAA is going along with them to get some, the latter ( bold letters ) is just my opinion

[Musicman51]

Well these were just some suggestions a couple of well intended kj's up here made was all. They both still use the old CDG disc, and welcome SC and their croonies to their show. And...ummm...i won't mention what they said they would do to them boys after they looked at their disc and decided they are indeed legal. But they are both small independent milk producers. And as i recall part of it was something about cows, and wondering how a person could sit down with a digital camera...well....nevermind.

[capnvic]

Ron,

Where were you that night? I noticed Paradiso and Moe's were on the list. Those two places are close to home...It makes me wonder if they are going to be hitting some of the private clubs as well....

[billyo]

Originally Posted by capnvic

Ron,

Where were you that night? I noticed Paradiso and Moe's were on the list. Those two places are close to home...It makes me wonder if they are going to be hitting some of the private clubs as well....

i don't think they will, in my opinion, private clubs are for members only, it's like playing in your own house, unless they are invited.

[muzicman144]

Originally Posted by billyo

i don't think they will, in my opinion, private clubs are for members only, it's like playing in your own house, unless they are invited.

I would tend to disagree with this statement. ASCAP/BMI?SESAC, etc. has no problem getting their money request in, and, no problem sitting in to hear what is played. A private club does not license illegal acts, IF, these suits prove to have merit.
I haven't seen a private club in my day that an invite was a problem at all. Some are strict, most have no door checkers, nor do they check membership cards. But sueing military clubs such as the Amercan Legion, VFW's etc. is just not a good publicity stunt at anytime, especially during a time of war or conflict (war is war no matter how it is worded)
I believe private clubs are targets just as open to the public clubs are. JMHO
muzicman144

[billyo]

Originally Posted by muzicman144

I would tend to disagree with this statement. ASCAP/BMI?SESAC, etc. has no problem getting their money request in, and, no problem sitting in to hear what is played. A private club does not license illegal acts, IF, these suits prove to have merit.
I haven't seen a private club in my day that an invite was a problem at all. Some are strict, most have no door checkers, nor do they check membership cards. But sueing military clubs such as the Amercan Legion, VFW's etc. is just not a good publicity stunt at anytime, especially during a time of war or conflict (war is war no matter how it is worded)
I believe private clubs are targets just as open to the public clubs are. JMHO
muzicman144

American Legion , VFW is in my opinion not really a private club,since they will sell drinks/food to the public,you could get in to those places as long as you know someone ,which i used to go and i am not a member of the org. i play in a country club which has sec. guard right by the gate and your name has to be listed in what they call guests list,or was invited by a member and still have to have your name on the list. a friend who was supposed to help me out set up my gears at one time tried to get in and they woudnt let him in , till i asked the club mgr. to let him in and put his name on the list.

[muzicman144]

[quote=billyo;98675]American Legion , VFW is in my opinion not really a private club,since they will sell drinks/food to the public,you could get in to those places as long as you know someone ,which i used to go and i am not a member of the org.

The charter of the VFW or American Legion does not allow purchases by non members. The are required to have a member sign them in and they still cannot make a purchase. None that i know of sell food or drinks to the public as it's charter bylaws do not allow this, except on special designated events.
As you and i know well, these restrictions are ignored quite often, yet, they ARE private clubs. You can get into any club if you know someone, which i'm sure KIAA or the Slepps could arrange to get into your private club date without a problem.
They real answer is to avoid buying a Sound Choice Product. Hit them where they are trying to hit you!!!!
muzicman144

[billyo]

Originally Posted by billyo

American Legion , VFW is in my opinion not really a private club,since they will sell drinks/food to the public,you could get in to those places as long as you know someone ,which i used to go and i am not a member of the org.

Originally Posted by muzicman144

The charter of the VFW or American Legion does not allow purchases by non members. The are required to have a member sign them in and they still cannot make a purchase. None that i know of sell food or drinks to the public as it's charter bylaws do not allow this, except on special designated events.
As you and i know well, these restrictions are ignored quite often, yet, they ARE private clubs. You can get into any club if you know someone, which i'm sure KIAA or the Slepps could arrange to get into your private club date without a problem.
They real answer is to avoid buying a Sound Choice Product. Hit them where they are trying to hit you!!!!
muzicman144

a friend of mine played at one of the VFW's at one time and i was able to get in and bought a few drinks, and i also know that they have diff. menu's on diff. days,but anyway that's true all the KJ's should stop buying SC, hit them where it hurts

[ddouglass]

Originally Posted by billyo

American Legion , VFW is in my opinion not really a private club,since they will sell drinks/food to the public,you could get in to those places as long as you know someone ,which i used to go and i am not a member of the org. i play in a country club which has sec. guard right by the gate and your name has to be listed in what they call guests list,or was invited by a member and still have to have your name on the list. a friend who was supposed to help me out set up my gears at one time tried to get in and they woudnt let him in , till i asked the club mgr. to let him in and put his name on the list.

I beg to differ with you. Most American Legions and VFW do limit who can come in and they usually know who their members are. Members can bring in a guest, but they have to be with that member and cannot enter on their own. Not all American Legions and VFW serve drinks and some who do will only sell to their own members and not to members from other posts.
The VFW I play at is one of the exceptions and is open to the local populace only because we are one of three (used to be two) clubs in the local area. This is not the case in the larger towns around us. By the way Musicman144, VFW National does not even want to hear anything about the canteen most posts have. It is like they want to stick their heads in the sand. The Bylaws that set down the rules are locally produced and are sent to National just to make sure the legal wording is correct.
All that said I know Musicman is correct that the music organizations have no problem getting in any club to check licenses for things like jukeboxes, TV and radio usage. I doubt that the KIAA would have any problem either.