Interesting Perspective

[SteveWalker]

MaddMatt, of course I agree that when you get to 6-8 singers the rotation is long enough for the customers who came to sing and I don't need to either fill in time or increase their wait. I have singers come to my shows all the time with CD holders with over 200 CD's inside them. That's more CDG's than many KJ have. Many of them are good singers and bring in their friends. In this case it should be intuitive that my show is "not just about me". Some KJ's go by the name "U-Star Productions" if you know what I mean. I think MOST KJ's understand all this and although most KJ's like to sing, they really just are out to have fun and make a little money. For me, I sang in bands for many years and more recently in the Clearwater Chorus with many professional singers, musicians and teachers.

Steve

[bubba1453]

MaddMatt,

Your right on the public is there to sing. I just got rid of a guy that sang all the time. he would have a list of 30 songs that he like to sing. would sing background on songs without asking the singers. would always finsh the night with him singing. He was a problem child.

[jaddams]

I recently returned from a short trip to Palm Beach where I went to take two of my three children to college. While I was there, I decided to go to a karaoke bar, nice place, gorgeous atmosphere, I couldn’t wait until the show started at 9pm so I could sing in such a nice place.

Exactly 1 ½ hours later (10:30 to be exact,) I left that place totally disappointed because of a very unprofessional KJ.

The sound system was great, Shure M-58 microphones, CDG’s and LaserDisk players, the place even had singer’s monitors, the works!

What was missing? A professional KJ. The one performing that night was an outright frustrated amateur singer who used the bar’s owner facility to showcase his louse singer.

Eight songs he sang within that 1 ½ . Eight songs even thought there were several singers waiting to be called. Three of them were sitting next to me at the bar with the same complaints I had.

What happened later? I have no idea; I left that place to never come back again on a karaoke night. I go to Palm Beach often t see my children, now we go other places and so do most of my friends.

The day I see a DJ dancing every other song spun by him, that’s the time I would find another place to go dancing.

Regards,

Jon

[S. Parks]

Boy Flip, he must have slapped raw nerves with you on that one. You take exception to most of his suggestions as though you may have been accused of personifying these things he mentions. I think as You yourself said, that for the most part his advice would be sound advice for anyone to be successful with any kind of business. Basically, if the shoe fits wear it. Otherwise I personally don't know why one would find these veiws so distubing. Just my opinion.

[MaddMatt]

All:

I don't know exactly who the last post was referring to, but I'll reiterate that I was never trying to piss off anybody with my posts.

Are they basic to a number of businesses? Yes!
Do most Kj's have a long background in self-emplyement? No!

If they are common sense to you, Great! My goal was to provide an "Interesting Perspective" to KJ's out there.

I am glad that some people took it to heart and also happy to hear that others already heed the advice.

Madd Matt
www.maddmatts.com

[MaddMatt]

All:

I don't know exactly who the last post was referring to, but I'll reiterate that I was never trying to piss off anybody with my posts.

Are they basic to a number of businesses? Yes!
Do most Kj's have a long background in self-emplyement? No!

If they are common sense to you, Great! My goal was to provide an "Interesting Perspective" to KJ's out there.

I am glad that some people took it to heart and also happy to hear that others already heed the advice.

Madd Matt
www.maddmatts.com

[MasterJP80]

MaddMatt, you have started one hell of a conversation. Like Flip ( I believe), I have been in the business for 10 years. This is a business. I am very good at it and people say so. The area I live in has many companies. However, the ones that charge to undercut, are slow fading over the horizon. The reason I make good money and have been at my locations for a long period of time, is because I pay attention to business. For instance, I will interject a song with 140 BPM if to many ballads are being sung. I want the audience to get into the show, not fall asleep. Do I sing all the time? No, but, I do work the audience to get their temperature. I am doing business.

I do weddings, pool parties, BBQ cookouts, birthdays and the bars. I would not get all these shows if I did not do business. Nobody wants cheap. Everyone knows you get what you pay for. Thanks Flip.

[sevekj]

I finally just got through reading through all of the threads.
It was entertaining and informative.
Thank the Lord there are conscientious KJ's out there.
I have been in the biz now since 95, I discovered it in 91 at a company christmas party, I was well known for my Elvis act and I used to perform at the city Playhouse intermissions and for assorted events. I heard Karoake for the first time at my company christmas party and they were playing the background music to a variety of songs while we were eating our catered dinner, then Elvis, Suspicious Minds began playing and I was amazed at the background and how real to the original it was. Well I signed up right away, I was pretty new to the company at that time so most everyone did not know of my Elvis act, besides I was kind of shy about revealing it at the time, but that was soon going to change. I normally just played simple songs with my guitar, but know I would have a full band playing just like the real thing. Well, to make a long story short, I slayed them that night and won all kinds of prizes and everybody new me as Elvis after that. Now, I am a KJ and an Elvis Tribute Artist, I have sang with the Jordanaires in Las Vegas and Memphis and have been enjoying welcoming crowds for over 10 years.
I have been a KJ for 9 years, I did not own even one CDG before starting the business, I bought my business after considerable research and a stroke of luck. I began locating karaoke clubs to perform my act in and I began paying attention to how the KJ's ran their shows and took care of their business, I learned from the best and the worst. Long story short again, I no longer do Mobile gigs, I do 7 days a week, I own the business and have 2 hired KJ's that I have trained to do the business when I can't, they really don't do the business, I do the business, they just host the show the way I have taught them to do on my nights off, I take care of all the behind the scenes stuff, you guys in the biz know what I am talking about.
Ok, sorry I have mounted a rotation board (to get to the meat of the subject) I created it from a dry erase board framed and very professional looking and set in thirty spots on it.
First singer ME! Always me first, (this makes sense to most good KJ's) then introduce the first victim I mean singer (just a joke everybody always laughs) They have already been written into slot 1 on the board, everyone sees it, and when I don't know who is up I look at the board or I will ask the audience to help me out and tell me who is next (another joke, gets the audience involved) this goes for every swinging singer, they get on the board (sign up sheet for some of you) and they remain there through out the night. Example : Busy night first rotation crazy 30 singers rotation was built up to 30 in the first 15 minutes rotation full come back tommorow earlier or stay and I will put you on the bottom of this list when space allows ie: people leave the premises or forget to sign up again and get dropped from the list, although if I see them which I pay special attention to all customers and singers in the lounge I will allow them to remain on the board as long as I have their slips. As long as you are at my show you will sing after the person you sang after all night unless they leave or are dropped from the board for lack of slips (usually meaning they have left or when they finished Pardise City their throat was history so they opted to pass on the rest of the week.) I have a little recipe box that I use as my working tool to place their professionally made slips 4X6 and there are 30 slots, once you are in that slot you stay in that slot and if you want you can bring me 20 slips, I will play them in the order you hand them to me, I place them in the appropriate slot standing upright and in front of the slot and when the song is finished I place it in the back of the same slot only lay it on it's side and in back of the rest of the slips in the slot. At the end of the evening I save the slips of all the regulars and if a new singer request I save their slips I will after they come to my show 5 times I make them a personal bag with their Name on it and it goes into this cool container I bought at walmart which holds over a hundred different bags of all my regulars, I use top quality Ziplock bags to store each singers slips, they love it. My rotation is the fairest in Land and I get nearly no complaints. There is a lot more to my rotation than what I have mentioned here now. I will input more later as it is nearing time for me to run my show. Toodle oooo!

Seve

[kedmison]

I too save the singers song slips, but rather than a ziplock bag, (once someone has become a regular) I provide a little binder clip that I put on their slips and they take them with them when they leave. Saves them time looking up their standards and saves me slips!

Kelly

[sevekj]

Originally posted by kedmison
I too save the singers song slips, but rather than a ziplock bag, (once someone has become a regular) I provide a little binder clip that I put on their slips and they take them with them when they leave. Saves them time looking up their standards and saves me slips!

Kelly

I think I remember reading about your clip thing.
What exactly is it? Like a paper clip, how do you keep a file. Or do you just let them take it home. I know if I did that, they would always forget it at home and still have to fill out new slips.
I use the ziplocks, cause I find they are just the right size, sandwichbags for the slips and I use a standard type mailing label and stick it in the upper center of the bag to put their name on it and I use a box to file them alpabetically by first letter in first name and when they come to the show I have the box out where they can paruse through and find their own bag. plus when they take them to their table they are protected as long as they are in the bag from spilled beer and the like.
Well I gotta go now, later Kelly, thanks for the reply.

Seve

[SteveWalker]

I agree that you should file the slips as a personal service to the customer. Giving the slips to the customer means that he/she has to remember to bring them but more importantly he/she could just as well take the slips to someone else's karaoke show! Kinda self defeating isn't it. The majority of my singers bring their own CDG's to the show and all I need from them is one slip all night with their name on it.

Steve

[kedmison]

Well for one, they DO remember to bring them back. Once in a blue moon a regular will for get. Not all regulars use a clip to save their slips. Also MY slips wouldn't do them any good at another karaoke place because my numbers wouldn't match some else's system. I also have on my slips my name, phone number and email for advertising purposes. I wish they would take them to other venues.

Very seldom do my patrons bring their own discs. Why, I don't know. Usually someone who does bring their discs, does not seem to bring them back the second time. Not sure if it's they like my selections or what. I have almost 7,000 songs. With no dupes. When I buy my discs, I pick out what version, (Sound Choice, Chartbuster ets. ) I generally prefer S.C. but have found other versions I like better. If my patron doesn't like my particular version then they can bring their own.

I guess I'm doing something right. I only do this part time. I am a full time fire chief and am currently doing karaoke 3 nights a week at the same place. Sunday, Monday and Wednesday. Monday night is the biggest night. It has begun to out do the bands they have on the weekends. And I have been at this same place going on my third year.

A little more information while I'm sharing ideas...

I also for my convience use Micro Studio to put my discs together before I put them into Hoster. I do not use the data bas option in Hoster. When I first started karaoke I begin with a Sony 400 player and Micro Studio. As I bought my original discs, I would attempt to copy as close to 20 songs per disc. I did this to save space in my player. As Hoster has no come along I still do this. I have about 12 discs coming in from Ebay this week. Once disc may have only 4 songs on it that I want or need. Another one may have 12. I record these into my desk top computer and when I have a least 20, I copy these to a compiled disc, Put my origianl discs away, load the compiled disc into Hoster, and file my compiled disc into my Sony 400 which is my backup.

For example "I love this bar" is listed as #31808 in Hoster. If my MTU laptop was down for any reason, I could use my Sony 400 and I would know that #31808 in my song books was also Disc #318 Track 8. Also by having a compiled disc, I may find down the road that I like a better version of i.e. "I love this bar" I'll then take my compiled disc out recopy all but song number 8 and then recopy with the new version. My original discs are never used but one time and then they are put away for safe keeping.

Is this a lot of work, most would say yes but it a system that I have come to like. Haven't had to use my back up player yet. Knock on wood. Have beeen using my MTU laptop for over a year now, never failed. Only once did I have to cut short a night and that was operator error. The Sony's Day's are numbered. I will be looking at externall drives in the future. Sorry for getting so winded. As always, Great Job MTU!

Kelly

[kedmison]

Ok, I've shared some knowledge, now I need some anwsers. I've have been using Excell for some time to do my books. I'm wanting to do it in a different format but not sure how to do it. My current format is like this: i.e.
Beatles A HARD DAYS NIGHT 10815
Beatles ACT NATURALLY 26219
Beatles ALL MY LOVIN' 920
Beatles ALL YOU NEED IS LOVE 26216

What I want to do is this:

Beatles
A HARD DAYS NIGHT 10815
ACT NATURALLY 26219
ALL MY LOVIN' 920
ALL YOU NEED IS LOVE 26216

I have seen this used before and it seems to take up less paper and makes a more atractive looking book. I don't need a program that has a data base. I just want to be able to convert my excell into this format. Any ideas.

Thanks,

Kelly

[S. Parks]

KJpro will make a book in that format. Their Database is very good too. I still prefer Hosters book however, since it offers more flexibility to alter the appearance of the final product.

[Kathy_oke]

Originally posted by SteveWalker
Giving the slips to the customer means that he/she has to remember to bring them but more importantly he/she could just as well take the slips to someone else's karaoke show! Kinda self defeating isn't it.

I'm very new here. I've browsed through some of these threads and cannot help but respond to this one.

Singers WILL take their song tags to other shows. I've found my song tags on the floor of other venues. Personally, I found that to be a thrill!!!

What I did with mine was to put my regular venue location, telephone number, a Map and my hours on the back ... in essence, I turned it into a business card ... one never knows who will see it!!

~ Regards ~

[crazycarl]

I have read this post till I'm sick. you stated that the karaoke host"IS NOT THE TALANT" I wish you were with me tonight, for every karaoke singer there is some where a host that got them through the shyness for there first song. It is more work than you think to keep a crowd of 40 or 50 people entertained. Come Join me for a week, and you will find that this bussiness is a lot of work.
crazycarl

[swany]

Every so often, go to some other place that is a busy place with a lot of regular clientel and see what they do that you don't and like any good entertainer use what you learn, the first KJ like a new parent had no prior expierience you can learn by doing or ask someone you know and respect, like the elder of the KJ group that seems to get along with everybody, the people you are visiting are probably doing the best they can but by all means get into a good rig and take your notes with you and see how many of your list rules you break the first year I'd be willing to wager all of them at least twice a month. Do have a good show and remember all the mistakes you make and hope your regulars will forgive your mistakes. Above all do have fun every show, you are after all behind the mike and in the entertainment business.
Good luck and God bless.

[Garry A. Leslie]

Hello All,
Reading through this thread again, I get the impression that the US hosts karaoke venues with massive audiences, which obviously gives rise to the need to make rotation and whatever method of signing up people fair.
I have only been to one in the Mint Lounge, San Francisco
Here in the UK a lot of venues are small and often badly run. A lot of KJ's are incompetent and I would imagine they are the same in any other job they do.
They do all the things which we all accept as bad, on a regular basis.
When I run a karaoke I follow most of the accepted rules to run a good show and still make mistakes.
I sing well enough to have been offered engagements by bars and clubs to sing a programme for an evening, not karaoke.
I try to sing in my natural voice and not copy the singers on the records, although as most karaoke singers would agree, sometimes you get caught up in style of the song. I offer Tony Bennett as an example, you rarely hear other singers tackle his material (except leaving a heart in SF), because the songs he sings seem to have been written for him.
I have been in bars, hosting karaoke, where 100 people have sat all night without ever wishing to get up and sing, in this case the KJ had better be able to sing well. You can see the relief on their faces when someone they know can sing, walks through the door.
I was at a show last night, where the KJ starts off singing to quite a small crowd, he then gives anyone he knows the chance to sing 2 songs together. Ones he doesn't know get to sing 1 song.
Once he has started this he keeps this going even when the crowd swells with known singers. Towards the end of the evening he asked me to do 2 songs, I had to tell him I was doing one because of the number who were still waiting.
He didn't get it!!
And he's one of the better ones. I am sure a lot of you guys would be severely ticked off singing over here.
Regards from across the pond.
Garry