rate of pay around the country.

[TraxMasterDJRob]

I like what I'm reading. Seems to me most of us KJ's/ DJ's got the general idea of what's going on. I live in SW Michigan, and all of your stories have rung true. keep up the good communication, Merry Christmas

[alanross]

Location is a definite factor. I live in a resort area on the Outer Banks of North Carolina and pay rates here are extremely low. Because the area relies almost entirely on tourism for revenue, and there are only three good months of that tourism in the summer, the rest of the year is all about stretching out your summer earnings. We are the only entertainment company in this area including, solo acoustic guitarists, duos, DJs, bands and comedians that are able to remain profitable all year round. Even in the off season, we're doing 12 shows a week - unprecedented for this area. During the busy summer months, we are doing anywhere from 22-26 shows a week.

It has been a hard fought battle to get our pay to $200.00 a night year round, but we make $300.00/night in season at the larger venues. Many wanna-be systems have tried to come in and undercut our prices, but they've all left within 6 months because they couldn't match the quality of the sound system, the selection of music, the professional presentation of our shows and most importantly, they couldn't come close to the energy of the shows we run because of our talented, audience-friendly hosts.

The problem is most bar owners are looking at us through the wrong prism. After much discussion, I have finally brought people around to my way of thinking. How many of you play in a club which also does live bands on other nights of the week? Does the bar owner pay them $200 a night? Even the low end bands usually get $300 or $400 a night. The bar owners usual reason for paying them more? "There's four of them in the band, you're only one person."

Here's where their thinking is totally wrong!

I have had to spell it out to them, more than once, it doesn't matter if there is one person or twenty. When I play in your club, your bar sales are consistently over $2000.00, more than any other nights of the week. But when bands play here, your bar sales are only $1000.00. If you want to keep me playing here, and generating that kind of revenue, I need to make more money. You're not paying for the number of people who are coming in to entertain, you're paying for an entertainer to increase your bar sales! That's why you're doing entertainment in the first place!

Bar owners forget that they have entertainment at night to increase the number of people coming into their club and therefore increaseing their revenue. Once you explain that you are their best revenue generator (which I have fortunately been able to prove), they understand why you deserve more pay and they will pay.

Only once did I have a bar owner tell me that it would be cheaper for him to buy his own equipment, and disks and have one of his own employees run the show. He did that, and now he's regetting the decision because he failed to realize that not just anyone can host a karaoke show and generate the kind of revenue our shows did.

I have taken years to find just the right personalities to hire a show hosts and because of it, all our hosts are top quality and they all put out the type of shows that people like to see.

First you have to be the best at what you do, then you have to do it consistently. Once you've established your reputation and a following, you can demand the higher rates.

Here's a few tips to any new or potential Karaoke hosts: Remember, no matter how much you like to sing and no matter how great you may be, it's not about you. Make the show all about the audience. Set up strict guidelines for behavior and adhere to them. Give every vocalist a huge round of applause, allow no booing! Eliminate disruptive influences. If someone is getting out of hand, cut 'em off. Don't call them up to sing again that night. Be nice and explain that you have to entertain the whole room, not just him and his friends, and if he wants to come back next time and behave himself, great! Put together a sound system that makes people sound fabulous and you will get the fabulous vocalists at your shows. This doesn't have to be expensive, it's all about having a good enough ear to hear what you're doing and the patience to adjust the settings for each and every vocalist.

I HATE going to Karaoke shows where the host never adjusts anything but the volume. Each disk and each vocalist needs to be tweaked in the high, mid and low ranges of the sound. Some people have very shrill voices where you have to cut a lot of treble out, while others have very bassy voices that need less bass, more treble, less mid. The trick is learning how to adjust each vocalist within the first verse and chorus of each song so you can still mingle with the audience and work the room.

Doing a show RIGHT is work, but done right, you can earn what you're worth and not even worry about being undercut. We've kept going no matter how many other systems have tried to knock us out. QUALITY QUALITY QUALITY!!!!

[shanold1]

Hi everyone, I am new to this. I provide the equipment for wife to put on shows. We do a four hour show at the American legion in Albany, Or for $200.00 and depending on the crowd if we go over it is $50 an hour. Many times we go over. We do a show for the Lebbanon, OR Moose and charge $150 for 4 hour show with $50 hour per hour over. It was a struggling club about to fold now we have them going strong on the nights we are there.

We do wedding for $400 a gig.

Happy KJ
Steve

[SteveWalker]

Originally posted by alanross
QUALITY QUALITY QUALITY!!!! [/b]

At first I said that's a large post to read but after reading it I was impressed and it's good information for us all to consider.

Steve

[rsmith5102]

As in any business, this is the rule. Karaoke is now so saturated in this country, that premium rates are only available to those that are located in tourist areas, or large cities. My company is located in the center of Michigan, which is very rural. Competition is fierce, but those of us that have been around for awhile (10+ yrs), know that only quality and quantity survive. We have the "hosts" that come into places with the latest in Wal*Mart technology, and have to deal with it. They don't last long, and the people know where the quality can be found. However, it is still difficult to find an owner of an establishment to part with his hard earned money to risk paying what an experienced KJ can provide. I often invite my prospective employers to visit one of my other shows, so they can see what actually happens. Sometimes it helps, other times, they say "Well, they know your here and come no matter what." I say, "Yeah, and who knows better."

Who said it was easy?

[PastMember]

Here's a LOOONNNG one from my archives. Explains it pretty much like it is... without the added "garnish." I will begin handing this to everyone that comes up to me and say; "I wanna be a host!



Dear New Host:

The first piece of advice I always give is to take a quick look at your motives for becoming a KJ before making such a big investment....and it is a BIG investment, if you do it right.

Forgive my bluntness, but I like to give you the cold hard facts about the job and how important your motives are, since most people won't. I am NOT trying to discourage you...just giving you all the info to consider before you open your wallet, so take it with a grain (or boxcar) of salt.

Here are a few questions to ask yourself....

# 1. DO YOU WANT TO BE A "STAR"?
If you want to be a "legitimate musician", be a star, make records, work on Broadway, or be a "big shot" of any kind in the entertainment industry, please don't host karaoke.

If you want to "be a star", you owe it to yourself to go chase after that dream, because karaoke will never be able to fill that void for you, and it's not fair to expect it to.

If you don’t follow your dream, then chances are you’ll eventually get a bad attitude, make everybody's lives miserable in the process (including yours) and end up selling your stuff for half of what you paid for it. Think about this question CAREFULLY, because if you're “settling” for karaoke because you don't think you can make it anywhere else, you will be horribly disappointed.

# 2. DO YOU EXPECT TO SING ALL THE TIME?
If you want to sing all night, walk away now. One of the surest ways to kill a show is for the host to hog the mic. It's rare that I sing more than two songs all night....the opening song, and the closing song. If there's more than four (4) singers, I drop out of the rotation. The show is for the singers, not the host. If you plan to try making a show into your own private showcase, don't bother becoming a KJ because you won't succeed. You need to be good enough to carry the show by yourself, but only if there are no other options.

Regardless of what they say to puff up your ego, the bottom line is that the singers came to sing, not to hear you sing. If you can't handle this concept, you're in trouble before you even start.

If you need to “scratch the itch” to sing, it’s best to go to somewhere else to scratch it so you’re not inclined to use your own show. Karaoke can be a drug, and what was that old drug dealer's saying they used in Scarface? "Don't get high on your own supply." Good advice.

# 3. ARE YOU COMPETITIVE WITH OTHER SINGERS?
If you compete with your own singers, you're dead. If you are threatened by singers who are better than you (and there WILL be some, no matter how good you are) you're dead. I have actually known KJs who will deliberately mal-adjust the sound to make a good singer sound bad because they were jealous.
If you feel this way, please don't host.

If you are an excellent singer, you will learn that it can be in your best interest to tone it down a bit at your own show. If you're percieved as trying to "show up" the singers, they will abandon you. Not only that, but if you go out there and blast one right off the bat, those poor new people who might have tried karaoke could be scared off, thinking they have to be as good as you.

# 4. DO YOU NEED A LOT OF VALIDATION?
Some people think that becoming a KJ will raise them up a few notches on the social strata, and that everybody will automatically be even more supportive of them when they sing. Nothing could be farther from the truth.

You will be criticized more than regular singers, people will sometimes snicker at your job, and your talent will often be taken for granted. Even when you give an outrageous performance on a song, you will recieve much less applause than you did when you were "just a singer", since you are expected to give a good performance because you're now a host.

# 5. ARE YOU A SELF-APPOINTED VOCAL COACH OR MUSIC CRITIC?
One of the hardest things to do as a host is to resist the urge to tell others how to sing and what they're doing wrong. It is imperative that hosts never criticize or offer unwanted advice.

People are very vulnerable when they step up on stage, and the LAST thing they need to hear about afterward is what they did wrong.

If they ask for advice, if you agree to give it at all (which I generally don't) it needs to be very gentle and encouraging. Your singers trust you to protect them so don't betray their trust.

If you criticize your singers, especially within earshot of them, you're dead. If you think it's funny to put others down, this job is not for you.... you can only do damage.

I look at it this way; anybody who gets up there deserves respect and support just by virtue of their courage alone. Whether they can sing or not is irrelevant.

# 6. DO YOU LIKE TO PARTICIPATE IN BARROOM GOSSIP?
One of the hardest things about this job is to stay out of the gossip arena, and separate yourself from the soap opera that is the bar scene. If you decide to do this job, you may find that it's healthier to distance yourself a bit from the "customers" and their personal dramas.

You'll develop your own method of coping, but mine is that the job is the job, and my private life is my private life, and I keep the two separate. I don't "hang out" with regulars outside the show.

You can work in the scene, but if you really want to succeed, be careful not to let it work into you.

Realistically, this job can drive you crazy sometimes. That's why it's important to cultivate good relationships with other KJs so that you can have someone to safely "vent" your frustrations to.

If you need to bitch about stuff that happens at a show, or singers who grind your butt, "vent" to another KJ you trust. Never gripe to a customer about another customer, or allow customers to criticize each other.... It’ll kill your show FAST.

# 7. DO YOU EXPECT TO MAKE BIG MONEY?
Here's a biggie. This is a labor of love. Even if you're great at this job, it ain't never gonna make you a million bucks.

I make very good money compared to the industry standard, and still barely break even, because so much of it goes right back into the business. Bottom line, it'll nickel and dime you to death....and the outlay doesn't stop with the initial investment.

If you want to stay current, expect to lay out at least $200-300 minimum for music and expenses PER MONTH. If you don't spend it all that particular month, I'd advise you throw it into an emergency fund for equipment replacements.... you’ll need it eventually....trust me.

Okay...let's pause and step back for a second. If it seems like I'm painting a grim picture of hosting, it's mostly because, going in, so many people think it's all wine and roses.... but nobody tells you the downside, so I do. If you said yes to any of the above questions, you need to think carefully before you take on this job.

I just believe in going in with your eyes open. It's give-and-take, just like anything else. KJing can be one of the best jobs you'll ever have.... if you have the right attitude. If you do this right, you can work where you want, when you want, for the amount of money you want (more or less), you make the rules and you have a lot of freedom.... it’s great.

Plus, if you are careful and considerate of other KJs (which is in your best interest to do), you have the peace of mind that comes from doing a job that doesn't hurt anyone else and brings a little magic into people's lives at the same time.

The bottom line is that hosting karaoke is really good stuff, as long as you don't expect it to be something it isn't.

[SteveWalker]

C. Staley,

Excellent information and oh...so true!

Steve

[alanross]

C. Stanley, you are so right!

If you don't mind, I'll be printing out your post to add to our new hire welcome package.

If I can be so bold as to add to you post:
1) Alcohol consumption during a show doesn't make you better at your job.
2) The audience doesn't care if you're having a bad day. Leave your problems at home - on stage, the world must be bright and happy.
3) With only rare exceptions, the audience members aren't your dear friends, they are acquaintances.
4) Remain neutral in all disputes. You are everyone's "friend" without exception.
5) Make sure to work well with the staff of each establishment. The audience doesn't want to see any friction.
6) No matter how much you dislike someone, give them the same enthusiastic introduction you give your favorite vocalist.
7) Don't allow people to jump up and join someone singing without the singer's permission. It's not cute or cool or funny. It's rude.
8) Your respect for the audience will be returned to you, so give generously.

Pay attention to all these things and you can eventually raise your rates to make a more equitable pay.

[danny_g]

Complete agreement with Alan and C. Staley. Had to take a little leave of absense due to not being able to keep my personal business from affecting my job performance. Using to the time to reinvent my system.

[Roger Rents]

I've been doing mobile karaoke for about 20 years now and charge $400 for 5 hours of playing time ($50 and hour overtime). I also work at a local club 3 nites a week (Sunday to Tuesday) and get about $125 to $175 a night (depends on tips) plus dinner and refreshements. I find its a great way to book weekend parties, and since most of the equipment, ie. speakers, amp, TV's etc. are already there, I just have to bring my discs and player. My system is based on laser discs, but recently I been purchasing CDG's to keep up with the new music, and have been investigating the Hoster program, I'm gettting to old to carry all those huge discs and players from gig to gig. Mahalo (thanks) for reading my post, will be looking for ideas to improve my show from your posts. Aloha.

[bingo1912]

Hello all
I find it interesting that a Band playing covers can get $500 or more a night, Taking breaks every half hour , While us Hosts work our butts off all night, dealing with inebriated people, constantly taking abuse and getting no breaks,only average $150 a night (for 4 hours). Personally I charge $300 a night for a 4 hour "show"
I find Karaoke to be much more entertaining than a live band, except if you are looking to dance ect.
However it really doesn't matter that much how many songs you have, it's really the host that makes or breaks a show, and the host should get paid accordingly. I love to have fun and bring Karaoke guitars (no strings), hats wigs ect to make it more fun for the audience
I no longer work the bars and find private parties to be more fun and profitable.
There is a lot of competition in this area also, and there is a lot of backstabbing and undercutting going on,,, too bad they could all be making a better living if they would stick together, but such is the way of the world,,,,,,
I got into this forum because I'm building a new computer to utilise MTU's software. Can anyone give me any pointers on what parts might be most beneficial??
I would appreciate any information you can give.
Thanks
Gary Indiana
Songs from the Heart
Lynden Wa

[SteveWalker]

Originally posted by bingo1912
I find it interesting that a Band playing covers can get $500 or more a night,

A band has 4 musicians so each one will get $125 while the average karaoke guy gets $150

There is a lot of competition in this area also, and there is a lot of backstabbing and undercutting going on,,, too bad they could all be making a better living if they would stick together, but such is the way of the world,,,,,,:

I agree with you. Most of the KJ's that are undercutting us have nothing but illegal CDG's which is our biggest cost . I suggest that we "stick together" and get these people off the street. I would guess that 50% of the KJ's in this area didn't have to buy a single CDG which cost us over $1500 for every 1000 songs.

Steve

[bingo1912]

Seems like most of the Kj's in this area copy and trade their discs. You are right, most of the cost is in buying the disks, however printing and updating your books is also very expensive and time consuming. My book at present is fairly small but it still costs around $10 everytime we do it. My wife has discovered Kinko's which saves us a lot of time and ink. Do you have any other suggestions??
Also I didn't get any replies from people as to what would be the best setup computor-wise so I've gone ahead and had one custom built for music including MTU's cdrom burner and software in the package. I'm pretty excited!
I have a freind who is the linguist for their tribe. He is teaching the kids their native tongue and I'm helping him put together a disk with video graphics and sound as a teaching aid.
TTYL
Gary

[SteveWalker]

Originally posted by bingo1912
[b]Seems like most of the Kj's in this area copy and trade their discs.

Is it worth the risk of being prosecuted and huge fines?

My book at present is fairly small but it still costs around $10 everytime we do it. My wife has discovered Kinko's which saves us a lot of time and ink. Do you have any other suggestions??

I go to Office Depot and have them copy and put it in a spirol binding. Drop off and pick up.

Also I didn't get any replies from people as to what would be the best setup computor-wise

I think the new MTU pc would be good or look for a rackmount PC.

Steve

[bingo1912]

Steve
My wife has a good laptop I can use in the field.
What I'm after is a good studio machine for recording my music and making disks, I have purchased MTU's CDG burner and have a top of the line sound card,,,,,, I haven't recieved the computor yet as I had them ship the burner directly to the person that is doing the custom work. I'm just looking for some hints as to what particular configuration would be most beneficial for what I'm doing.
P.S. I appreciate your replies
Gary

[SteveWalker]

Originally posted by bingo1912
What I'm after is a good studio machine for recording my music and making disks,

Can you be more clear about what you're doing? What are you recording? Is it original music with you playing guitar OR is it you encoding CDG's OR is it you making your own CDG's from music CD's?

Steve

[bingo1912]

Steve
Yes to all of the above. I want to make original music, I want to make Karaoke disks from audio CD's, and I want to make copys of my exisiting cdg's,,
Thanks
Gary

[SteveWalker]

As for original music I am using the Roland VS-2480 24 track recorder at

http://www.rolandus.com/products/det...odid=VS%2D2480

You don't need a PC with this unit and direct to PC recording requires dedicated PC and many fine-tuning issues. You can export wave files to the CD-ROM if you want to make karaoke CDG's. Encoding CDG's can be done on you wife's laptop same a I have done on my laptop.

Steve

[SteveWalker]

As for original music I am using the Roland VS-2480 24 track recorder at

http://www.rolandus.com/products/det...odid=VS%2D2480

Use this link with the period removed (I couldn't edit). I suggest MTU allow editing of a post for at least an hour or two after posting, then lock it.

Steve

[danny_g]

has anyone had trouble getting bars due to ascap and bmi now pursuing payments for having karaoke in their establishment? I have heard around my area that they are going to bars and saying that they owe one or two thousand dollars of unpaid dues for having karaoke.