How do I protect my Songs?

[cidvalue]

Hi all,

I'm a KJ in the South Florida area. My gigs are doing so well that I'm thinking about expanding operations. I plan to purchase a second set of audio gear and a laptop with Hoster installed so that I can hire someone to do gigs with me simultaneously.

As most of you know, for us KJ's our most valuable asset are the Songs themselves. I currently have about $5000 dollars invested in songs.

Can anyone think of a way to prevent someone from copying all my KMA files? As soon as I hire someone to work with me, they will be tempted to simply steal the songs by copying them to another hard drive. And then they can compete against me using my songs!

Is there a way to have songs like excel files be "read only"? Or require a username and password to transfer?

Your thoughts are appreciated.

[ddouglass]

Wish it were so, but Microsoft hasn't got any way to protect them. MTU has talked about bringing out an encryption program that would do what you need but have not said anything about it in a long time.

[Beavis]

ya know dale if there were only a way to not have the files disappear like they did in hoster v3.319 just get lost in the hard drive it would work.


remember when everyones kma files were getting deleted and the ones that were there they couldnt find.

to bad the files wouldnt just be un-findable in your system.

[marklwood]

Originally Posted by Beavis

ya know dale if there were only a way to not have the files disappear like they did in hoster v3.319 just get lost in the hard drive it would work.


remember when everyones kma files were getting deleted and the ones that were there they couldnt find.

to bad the files wouldnt just be un-findable in your system.

Before I had hoster, I used a cavs JB-99. They stored the songs in unformatted space on the HD. It made it impossible to just copy off for the less tech savy. You had to use Norton Ghost and know what software switches to use to even get a backup HD in case of failure.

[Flipeoke]

Originally Posted by cidvalue

...with Hoster installed so that I can hire someone to do gigs with me simultaneously...

Just remember, in order to do this legally, you would also need to purchase a second set of discs. For each simultaneous show, you need a set of karaoke discs (not just a copy on the harddrive).

[swany]

Simply make sure they understand the penalties that can be incurred to run equiptment that has been pirated. Your insurance, is simple they steal from you, you turn them in. Make a disk list of all your music keep it updated, if a theft occurs, they have to buy a Hoster program to use it, then install your music. They then have to have a complete original disk library of their own or they are in deep doo doo.

[cidvalue]

Yes, you are correct. In an ideal world this WOULD be the case. And I'm all for it. But now, let's get back to reality.

Does anyone know how to protect the songs in an external hard drive? I've noticed that there are some software that can make a hard drive read only. Has anyone used it with any degree of success?

I'm pretty sure some creative KJ have done it before although it may be unorthodox to admit it.

There is a guy, for example, called Boogie Man, down here in South Florida, that has a large network of KJs leveraging his original library of songs and making some serious money. My question is, how does he prevent his network from copying all of his songs? And trust me, it is not just him doing it. In practice I see this happening everywhere. If you tell me that YOU haven't seen this happening with KJs in your block, you're lying or blind.

So before we embark into a moral debate of what's right and what's not, let's try to focus on the issue at thand on this thread. My original question was, has anyone here been successful in accomplishing the task of protecting their songs from their network? And if so, How?

Thanks to all the other suggestions on the subject.

[ddouglass]

Making the drive read only still would not keep them from copying the files. If that were the case then you would not be able to copy your CDs to the hard drive since all CDs are read only.
As yet there is no way to protect the files. Even if you restrict the file access to one specific user with Windows security, then in order for Hoster to run your KJ would have to log in with that user and that would give them access to be able to copy the files.
Have you asked Boogie Man about it? I am sure if he has figured it out he would share his method.
I haven't seen this and I'm neither blind or lying. I live in the sticks way out of any city, so we only have two clubs in the area and no one will play at the second one because these rednecks get way out of control there.

[Flipeoke]

This is one of the main reasons that karaoke disc producers and manufacturers use practices like copy protection and why they faught to try and keep us from burning their songs to computer. Just because other people do it, does not make it right or legal. I do run multiple shows and I do it well enough, that I make enough money to have a set of discs for each show I run simultaneously. (Currently have 3 sets of every disc)

By running an illegal show, (using copied songs) it makes you NO DIFFERENT than the person who steals your songs and runs a show. Either way the karaoke producer/manufacturer is loosing profits to piracy.

Basically what you are asking is: How can I protect myself because I want to screw someone else? Think about it, you want to screw the karaoke producers by using copies, and yet you want to protect yourself so that no one can use your [illegal] copies.

If you run your show well, with integrety and professionalism, the money is there to be made. You don't have to resort to piracy to make a profit. This and hire KJ's you trust (and pay well) and you should have no worries...

Just my $0.02,
Flip

[marklwood]

Originally Posted by cidvalue

So before we embark into a moral debate of what's right and what's not, let's try to focus on the issue at thand on this thread. My original question was, has anyone here been successful in accomplishing the task of protecting their songs from their network? And if so, How?

Thanks to all the other suggestions on the subject.

Have you thought about a physical solution. To copy files, you need access to a port on the computer. You could build a road case screwed from the inside with carriage bolts and a locking door. From the inside of the computer, unplug the front USB connection and attach the computer to the road case. Install plenty of fans for ventilation and there you have it. The only access you really need is a power button to turn on the computer, and a connection for the amp.

[alpfleger]

Here is an idea you might want to consider. Do not use an external USB drive. Use an internal drive of sufficient capacity. There are programs available that will "disable your usb ports" using a password. Also there is a program called "Easy Disk Drive SafeGuard" this will write protect your files and still can be used on your computer. I believe it is a $40 program. The programs that will disable the USB ports cost about the same. There are also other methods to disable the ports also. These you can check out.
I have not yet done this as I am looking to upgrade my laptop drive first. I know that the EDDS program does work, but not with external drive.
Good Luck. I will post again after I have upgraded.

[swany]

I have seen a laptop, anchored to a plate with a USB drive anchored to it also. Don't know how, or why just seen it. Me I figure, with a 120-500GB laptops available, whats the point. I use my USB drive for backup only. Running two laptops, both have over 9000 kma and 9000 wma for kj and dj still room left over and both run well.

[ddouglass]

According to the blurb on "Easy Disk Drive Safeguard" and I quote, "When you hide or lock your drives, they become hidden or unavailable in all Windows software such as Windows Explorer, Outlook Express, Microsoft Office and so on." This means it would have to be unlocked or unhidden to be able to run and use any program. Which means to run Hoster your employee would have to have the capability of doing so which is not what is being looked for.
Disabling the USB ports would be a better method but it would have to be selective to allow mouse and/or keyboard operation.

[alpfleger]

When I downloaded the trial program I fould it had and unadvertised feature. A check off box to "write protect" the drive. You don't have to hide it and it will work. I did it but I did it with an external drive. It worked until you separate the external from the computer and copy the files from another computer. So it makes sense to use an internal drive and disable the USB ports. If a person wanted to go so far as taking your drive out, they could but you could prevent that also if you tried. I think what I mentioned above would suffice in most instances.

[cidvalue]

Thanks to all of you for your suggestions. I will try some of the methods suggested here such as disabling the USB ports and get back to you to tell you if it worked.

As a songwriter myself, I understand the copyright laws, and have made enough money to be able to purchase another set of songs for each one of my employees.

However, I still need to protect these songs because despite how much I pay my employees, people in the karaoke business (at least down here in Florida) are greedy as hell and will do anything to steal them from you.

It really pisses me off to have to compete with a whole bunch of KJs who have huge networks using illegal copies. This weekend I heard of a KJ having 22 shows per week! Just take moment to digest that number and do the math.

If anyone can think of other suggestions to protect our precious songs, they are more than welcome.

Cheers.

[Skybird74]

If someone out there is running 22 Shows & doesn't own 22 copies of the CDs, I think they should be reported. There are many out there who are illegal now because people are selling copies of their hard drives for cheap!!!!! And if enough keep doing it, then the Feds will come down & could penalize anyone who has even just 1 copy of a customer's song!

Recently when I was hired by a new place, I was asked if I was computerized because another person claimed to have 140,000 songs, so they assumed that I would also. I told them that anyone claiming to have that many songs & fairly new in the business, is either lying or illegal. The investment needed to own that much music cannot be recouped by working in clubs for only $150 per night. I explained that it took me months to upload my personal CDGs onto my computer & I have been doing this for many years. The number of songs a KJ has does not necessarily mean he has everything or that he can do a Good Show!!!!!!!! I have already proved this recently, when they pitted me against this particular person just last week. Customers all night kept telling me that my Show was smoother, faster & that I made the singers sound better than the previous KJ and that there were still many requested songs that he did not have even though I am only up to 12,000 songs now, compared to his 140,000!!!!!!

[Skybird74]

Originally Posted by cidvalue

If anyone can think of other suggestions to protect our precious songs, they are more than welcome.
Cheers.

If your songs are all in KMA format, then anyone copying them would have to also have Hoster in order to use them. Or, they would have to buy another program in order to convert them to mp3G for use in other programs.

You might want to be more careful who you hire! If they can afford the software or have the time to convert ........ maybe these are the kind of people you shouldn't hire! Hire only people who really need the money, not those who have the time & money to "pirate" your songs! If they have that kind of time & money, tell them to get their own equipment & go into business for themselves! Just my opinion!!!

[capnvic]

Originally Posted by Skybird74

If your songs are all in KMA format, then anyone copying them would have to also have Hoster in order to use them. Or, they would have to buy another program in order to convert them to mp3G for use in other programs.

You might want to be more careful who you hire! If they can afford the software or have the time to convert ........ maybe these are the kind of people you shouldn't hire! Hire only people who really need the money, not those who have the time & money to "pirate" your songs! If they have that kind of time & money, tell them to get their own equipment & go into business for themselves! Just my opinion!!!

Couldn't Agree more with you Sky....10 years in the business and still adding songs slowly but surely....

[admin]

MTU has been working towards a program called CRYPTO(tm) for several years. We have the technology right now to do this, but Vista has taken all our time this year.

1. It would lock all your KMA files to a SongCode installed on THAT computer. A SongCode would be like our Registration Codes to unlock our software. They would only install on probably ONE computer, and you, the owner would be the only one who could install and register it, and only when bought through your MTU Store account. We have done a lot of thinking and coding for this, and it WOULD BE absolutely protected. No one would ever use your encrypted KMA files, except... on the computer that SongCode is installed on... i.e., they'd have to steal the entire computer to use these encrypted KMA files.

2. We could require a SongCode to "re-register" at the mtu.com web site every 3-4 months to continue running, with significant warnings that time is running out so you'd never have it shut down on you. Once the 4 months was reached, it would cease to run. As soon as the computer was on-line, the SongCode would automatically re-register when Hoster ran. This way, if they steal the computer, it will stop running within 3-4 months. Since we can disable a RegCode (or SongCode), preventing it from being installed (or from continuing to run in the case of a SongCode), we could terminate the thief's use of the equipment.

3. You would need a "universal" backup of your un-encrypted master KMA files to create a new "locked" version.

4. We would modify Hoster to use the encrypted files using the SongCode for part of the decription (we go WAY WAY WAY beyond simple encryption ).

5. This would absolutely prevent someone from USING your KMA files from a CRYPTO + Hoster system.

6. MTU's Songverter software would NOT recognize the encrypted KMA files, and neither would any other converter that ever appears on the market.


We would need to sell CRYPTO for at least $250. It could run on ALL computers you have bought and installed YOUR Hoster RegCodes on, and yes, it would require the computers to be on-line to run CRYPTO, but not to run Hoster.

There is a very limited market for this technology, and it will be expensive to develop and test. Each SongCode would have to be purchased... I don't know the price we'd charge per use, but it must be reasonable or you won't buy it.

Who is interested and willing to pay this?

[billyo]

Originally Posted by admin

MTU has been working towards a program called CRYPTO(tm) for several years. We have the technology right now to do this, but Vista has taken all our time this year.

1. It would lock all your KMA files to a SongCode installed on THAT computer. A SongCode would be like our Registration Codes to unlock our software. They would only install on probably ONE computer, and you, the owner would be the only one who could install and register it, and only when bought through your MTU Store account. We have done a lot of thinking and coding for this, and it WOULD BE absolutely protected. No one would ever use your encrypted KMA files, except... on the computer that SongCode is installed on... i.e., they'd have to steal the entire computer to use these encrypted KMA files.

2. We could require a SongCode to "re-register" at the mtu.com web site every 3-4 months to continue running, with significant warnings that time is running out so you'd never have it shut down on you. Once the 4 months was reached, it would cease to run. As soon as the computer was on-line, the SongCode would automatically re-register when Hoster ran. This way, if they steal the computer, it will stop running within 3-4 months. Since we can disable a RegCode (or SongCode), preventing it from being installed (or from continuing to run in the case of a SongCode), we could terminate the thief's use of the equipment.

3. You would need a "universal" backup of your un-encrypted master KMA files to create a new "locked" version.

4. We would modify Hoster to use the encrypted files using the SongCode for part of the decription (we go WAY WAY WAY beyond simple encryption ).

5. This would absolutely prevent someone from USING your KMA files from a CRYPTO + Hoster system.

6. MTU's Songverter software would NOT recognize the encrypted KMA files, and neither would any other converter that ever appears on the market.


We would need to sell CRYPTO for at least $250. It could run on ALL computers you have bought and installed YOUR Hoster RegCodes on, and yes, it would require the computers to be on-line to run CRYPTO, but not to run Hoster.

There is a very limited market for this technology, and it will be expensive to develop and test. Each SongCode would have to be purchased... I don't know the price we'd charge per use, but it must be reasonable or you won't buy it.

Who is interested and willing to pay this?

i would pay it if i have people working for me, and if its my main source of income..